oceancube Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 Thank you for pointing this out! You are very lucky! It is always great to hear about different methods. The problem I am having is that my main spawning pair (my onyx pair) are still producing a lot of dud eggs. Even after laying for almost a year, more than half of the eggs in each clutch are duds. This may be a problem with the female, may be a problem with the male, but myself and others suspect that it is a nutritional problem. So the gourmet meals were recommended as a possible solution. As for my platinum male, I dont think anyone is suggesting that these gourmet feedings will help a young fish stop eating their eggs. It was brought up as a discussion of the overall health of the eggs ツ If you can successfully raise clowns and produce healthy fry without going through the extra work, more power to ya!! And I will definity keep everyone posted and monitor whether better nutrition leads to less duds in the onyx clutches. It may or may not so it will ne interesting to see. Thanks to everyone who has contributed to this discussion! We all have different methods and I love hearing about all of them! I too would ne curious to hear what facilities like ORA are feeding their broodstock. i wouldtry pellets and some cyclopeeze freezer bars with added vitamins, see if that helps any.... Link to comment
ericm1205 Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 most of us breeders try to feed a good diet and alot so they will produce better offspring. most fry health problems like protruding jaw, fin flare etc and misbarring is from the diet of the parents. i try to feed aggressive cause if i sell a clown i want it to be a perfect specimen and not getting accused of selling unhealthy pudgy face, or fin flare clowns. so i feel the extra feeding is worth it and a piece of mind for me. i still have some clowns who still eat the eggs also. they will get over it in time, but if it persists to long, i would maybe switch the male out, if he is the problem. if its a female problem then i would retire the female to a reef tank and get a new female. but i would try to rule everything out first. Link to comment
sweet<3 Posted May 7, 2012 Author Share Posted May 7, 2012 I feel the same as you Eric I would rather put out some extra effort if it means I can produce healthier clowns. As far as the egg eating goes, I know its not a problem with the female. I have hatched some of her babies out with other males. I know it takes time, whats causing me concern is that the male is making zero effort to fertilize. They literally come out of the female and into his mouth. I have never had this happen, my other males at least make the motion to fertilize. But i suppose time will tell whether or not this pairing will be successful Link to comment
ericm1205 Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 how old is he? he might be old enough to spawn but not really know what to do. i would give him like 5 nests to get it right if he doesn't, then i would retire him. if he is a really nice fish, then i would give him some more time. but for me i dont have a ton of patience, i would give him a few more times to get it right. if you know when they lay, feed them heavy the day of the laying . might deter him from eating the eggs. Link to comment
altolamprologus Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Forgive me if this is a crazy idea, but what about separating the pair and promoting the platinum to female? If he no longer has to assume the father role maybe he'll stop eating the eggs? I do realize it would be a while before he would start laying though Link to comment
sweet<3 Posted May 9, 2012 Author Share Posted May 9, 2012 how old is he? he might be old enough to spawn but not really know what to do. i would give him like 5 nests to get it right if he doesn't, then i would retire him. if he is a really nice fish, then i would give him some more time. but for me i dont have a ton of patience, i would give him a few more times to get it right. if you know when they lay, feed them heavy the day of the laying . might deter him from eating the eggs. I'm trying my best to be patient!! Haha. I have had this fish since October of '10. He was probably 6-8 months when I got him. So I'm guessing he is right around 2 years. He has eaten three clutches with no signs of fertilizing at all. Unfortunatly I think he is going to take more than five to get it right So he will stay as long as my patience lasts. I just love my big momma female and I don't want to wait anymore to raise her offspring!! **Sigh** Forgive me if this is a crazy idea, but what about separating the pair and promoting the platinum to female? If he no longer has to assume the father role maybe he'll stop eating the eggs? I do realize it would be a while before he would start laying though It's not crazy at all But like you said, it would take a while for him to be ready to lay. And I would have to shell out the $$ for another platinum... So hopefully there is some improvement in the next couple months!!! I have started feeding frozen with garlic and the garlic has made all the difference. The fish are going for it much more than my previous attempts. So hopefully this boost in diet will help iron out the kinks with my other pair... Link to comment
ericm1205 Posted May 10, 2012 Share Posted May 10, 2012 Patience is not my best virtue either. Especially with ADHD!!! I'm a mess lol!! I have a super snow male that is like yours. The occy female is 8 years old he is with and they are on their 3 laying. The eggs are ripped or eaten by the third day. I know he is fertilizing, cause the eggs are turning grey. I would give them like 12 to 15 layings to get the process down and sync up. If he doesn't get it by the 20th lay, then I would swap him out. If you do remove Him toss him with a female to keep him a male and he might get it together later with another female. I had to swap out a few of mine cause the just stopped getting along after a while. I had 2 Darwin pairs and I just swapped the males. Worked like a charm. What type of garlic are you using? How much do you add? I am going to make a new batch of food and I want to add garlic this time and see if it might help. I might add astaxanthin as well to get the brood to color up better and the babies. Cyclops works great to but you don't need as much xanthin as you would need to feed cyclops alot more. My food recipe costs me close to $200 to make 6-8 pounds of food. I get mysis in a 5.5ln brick. Hehe It's only $35 for it also. If I bought pre made food it would cost me well over $500 for the same amount. Link to comment
sweet<3 Posted May 15, 2012 Author Share Posted May 15, 2012 Patience is not my best virtue either. Especially with ADHD!!! I'm a mess lol!! I have a super snow male that is like yours. The occy female is 8 years old he is with and they are on their 3 laying. The eggs are ripped or eaten by the third day. I know he is fertilizing, cause the eggs are turning grey. I would give them like 12 to 15 layings to get the process down and sync up. If he doesn't get it by the 20th lay, then I would swap him out. If you do remove Him toss him with a female to keep him a male and he might get it together later with another female. I had to swap out a few of mine cause the just stopped getting along after a while. I had 2 Darwin pairs and I just swapped the males. Worked like a charm. What type of garlic are you using? How much do you add? I am going to make a new batch of food and I want to add garlic this time and see if it might help. I might add astaxanthin as well to get the brood to color up better and the babies. Cyclops works great to but you don't need as much xanthin as you would need to feed cyclops alot more. My food recipe costs me close to $200 to make 6-8 pounds of food. I get mysis in a 5.5ln brick. Hehe It's only $35 for it also. If I bought pre made food it would cost me well over $500 for the same amount. Ya patience is hard but necessary I suppose!! I am using Kent's garlic just because it was all the LFS had at the time. It seems to be working well though. I tried to just estimate and add the amount that the directions call for (kind of hard because it says something like two drops per teaspoon, which is hard to measure with the large amounts we are making). I started mixing in the Top Dressed Otohime into my pellet mix for my broodstock, but I would love to feed a more direct source of astaxanthin. Let me know if you find a good source that you like! I only made a small batch of food this time to experiment, but I think I'm gonna follow your example and start making the larger batches!! Link to comment
ericm1205 Posted May 16, 2012 Share Posted May 16, 2012 cyclops is a great source of xanthin. but you'll need to feed alot of it. i got my freeze dried cyclops from HERE they also sell xanthin as well. i get the 100g cans of cyclops and mix it with water in a condiment bottle. like the yellow and red ones you see in restaurants for mustard and ketchup. got my bottles are the grocery store and i add 5 huge spoonfuls and then quirt it into the tanks 2x a day. if you get some xanthin you can mix into the feeds. Link to comment
21093r53 Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 ahh see ur still at it bet ur a pro by now..lol i rember wen this thread got started so hows the hole thing goin sweet? whos this guy^^ How's the male doing any luck with a new clutch? Link to comment
sweet<3 Posted June 14, 2012 Author Share Posted June 14, 2012 Alright kids... I know I have been away for a while but I have some good news to report. The Onyx x platinum pair let their last nest go to day 3!!! The male was taking care of them for the first time and may have even fertilized some of them. Hopefully this means good things for the future! Its not the best, but here is a video on day 3 before the male ate the eggs: Link to comment
hooligan_78 Posted June 26, 2012 Share Posted June 26, 2012 Nice, looks really close to what my female looks like. Just an idea, but I put little "feet" made of putty to keep my pots from rolling around. You can just see them in the bottom of this pic: An older but better shot: Link to comment
Xanthi Posted August 5, 2012 Share Posted August 5, 2012 Tagging along! Really interesting thread. Building a breeder soon, so its definitely interesting to see the issues your running into! Link to comment
sweet<3 Posted August 5, 2012 Author Share Posted August 5, 2012 Nice, looks really close to what my female looks like. Just an idea, but I put little "feet" made of putty to keep my pots from rolling around. You can just see them in the bottom of this pic: An older but better shot: Our females do look similar! Maybe we can trade babies someday and expand our gene pool haha (that sounded odd ) That's a great idea with the pots I never thought of that! Tagging along! Really interesting thread. Building a breeder soon, so its definitely interesting to see the issues your running into! Welcome along! I haven't been posting much, but I will try to get back to it! If you have any questions feel free to ask. There are quite a few very successful, knowledgable breeders on this forum! Link to comment
Xanthi Posted August 5, 2012 Share Posted August 5, 2012 Have you had any luck at all?!! Link to comment
sweet<3 Posted August 5, 2012 Author Share Posted August 5, 2012 My onyx x onyx pair spawns regularly and I raise their babies. But at the moment, those are the only eggs I raise. My darwin x snowflake pair stopped laying for some mysterious reason. My onyx x platinum pair are laying regularly and the male is finally tending to the eggs, but he isn't fertilizing them. A batch of unfertilized eggs went seven days on their last spawn before they finally ate them. My darwin x black ice pair do not seem to be getting along anymore so im looking for a new female to swap in. So I just keep chugging along hoping for the best haha. Link to comment
Pickle010 Posted August 5, 2012 Share Posted August 5, 2012 So I just keep chugging along hoping for the best haha. Sometimes that's all you can do... Hey.. aren't you due for an avatar change? lol Link to comment
Xanthi Posted August 5, 2012 Share Posted August 5, 2012 Aww, what a bummer. If you could redo your set-up, what would you change? What books/threads would you recommend.? Where do you sell your fishies? Not too far away! Maybe if you're successful before i get set-up ill get to pick up some clowns from you! Link to comment
sweet<3 Posted August 6, 2012 Author Share Posted August 6, 2012 Sometimes that's all you can do... Hey.. aren't you due for an avatar change? lol You are so right! I have been slacking...haha Aww, what a bummer. If you could redo your set-up, what would you change? What books/threads would you recommend.? Where do you sell your fishies? Not too far away! Maybe if you're successful before i get set-up ill get to pick up some clowns from you! My setup right now is as perfect as I can imagine it being. I have redone it a few times, and with this setup have yet to find anything that I want to change. I actually haven't read any books on breeding. I hear Joyce Wilkerson's book is a great resource. There are multiple threads on here for breeding. Pickle's cliffnotes version of his thread that is a "sticky" at the top of the aquaculture section is probably the single most useful thread I have found as far as learning how to get started. Then I suggest just keeping up with the breeders on here and seeing what tips or methods they recommend. Ask lots and lots of questions. Don't be afraid to ask no matter how simple or silly the question may seem. Ultimately, its trial and error. You have to find what works for you. I currently sell my clowns just on the local forums (socali reefs and sdreefs). I have had a few stores express interent in my babies, but I haven't sold to any stores yet. What type of clowns are you interested in getting? I can keep you updated as to what I'm raising. Link to comment
Pickle010 Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 You are so right! I have been slacking...haha You know me ... always looking out! Glad I asked.... Link to comment
hooligan_78 Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 Actually, I would love an onyx male for her. I'm planning on taking the ocellaris male, turning him female and pairing him with a snowflake male. No more half-breeds for me! Link to comment
sweet<3 Posted September 13, 2012 Author Share Posted September 13, 2012 My first batch of Darwin x Extreme Snowflake babies!!!! Link to comment
Pickle010 Posted September 13, 2012 Share Posted September 13, 2012 I see a road trip in my future!!! Link to comment
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