Want to set up a Planted Tropical FW Tank and want some help

[gator11]

Has anybody set up a tropical FW before? If so I have a few questions.

 

In terms of cycling, does it need to be done? If so, what do you use to cycle the water.

 

Filtration: How is it done? Would an AquaClear cut it, or is there some sort of special liverock type thing that I'd need?

 

Setting it up; so I would assume substrate would go in first. then water, or plants? I'm not sure on that one. Also, if I put the plants in, could I put fish in the same day, or should I wait for the plants to take root?

 

Those are my first few, and if I think of more, I'll post 'em.

 

Thanks.

[BLoCkCliMbeR]

Has anybody set up a tropical FW before? If so I have a few questions.

 

In terms of cycling, does it need to be done? If so, what do you use to cycle the water.

 

Filtration: How is it done? Would an AquaClear cut it, or is there some sort of special liverock type thing that I'd need?

 

Setting it up; so I would assume substrate would go in first. then water, or plants? I'm not sure on that one. Also, if I put the plants in, could I put fish in the same day, or should I wait for the plants to take root?

 

Those are my first few, and if I think of more, I'll post 'em.

 

Thanks.

 

??

 

 

well ok i guess i got this one....you know there are FW planted forums right?

 

yes there is a cycle....much much shorter than a reef setup....maybe a week or two.......

 

aquaclear is pretty much this sites work horse......it will be great for your FW...

 

substrate.....get some good substrate, some flourite or a brand specificly made for FW planted, youll have better luck...they will make your water "muddy" at first, dont panic, let it settle....

 

as far as when to plant, you can plant before you add water or after...no right or wrong here......just remember youll be sturing up sediment when you plant w/ water in the tank.....

 

pour the water over a plate in the tank slowly to keep it from stirring up your substrate

 

there is no "live rock" for FW really......stay away from limestones, base rock, lace rock, shells etc as it will affect your waters hardness.....

 

driftwoods can make your water turn yellow, it passes w/. time and carbon.....

 

now all you need is some good FW lights.......PC are now cheap and just make sure you get the right bulbs for what your trying to do..

 

have fun

[gator11]

??

 

 

well ok i guess i got this one....you know there are FW planted forums right?

 

yes there is a cycle....much much shorter than a reef setup....maybe a week or two.......

 

aquaclear is pretty much this sites work horse......it will be great for your FW...

 

substrate.....get some good substrate, some flourite or a brand specificly made for FW planted, youll have better luck...they will make your water "muddy" at first, dont panic, let it settle....

 

as far as when to plant, you can plant before you add water or after...no right or wrong here......just remember youll be sturing up sediment when you plant w/ water in the tank.....

 

pour the water over a plate in the tank slowly to keep it from stirring up your substrate

 

there is no "live rock" for FW really......stay away from limestones, base rock, lace rock, shells etc as it will affect your waters hardness.....

 

driftwoods can make your water turn yellow, it passes w/. time and carbon.....

 

now all you need is some good FW lights.......PC are now cheap and just make sure you get the right bulbs for what your trying to do..

 

have fun

 

Thanks, and I apologize that I used this forum to ask about FW. I wasn't really sure where to go. Either way, the tank is going to be for my dad, and I'm not sure what fish he's going to want to get, but would you say that most tropical FW fish like the same temps as SW fish?

 

Also, I have the 12" CurrentUSA 18W Actinic 50/50 bulb. that should work right?

[MiddReef]

Just at tip to save you some cash on substrates:

 

Many FW plants need some hearty iron-rich substrate that is designed for growing fresh water plants, especially sword leafs and some of the more root-intensive species. Your LFS will want you to cover your entire tank with this stuff, because it’s fairly expensive…but you can work around this by instead creating little planting beds within your tank. Then you can use the standard rock or crushed rock substrate which is a lot cheaper, and have pockets of the more expensive plant-required substrate where you know you’re going to place your plants. Saves a lot of money and works really well. Also helps if you’re cleaning and you don’t have to worry about stirring up the finer material.

 

As far as lighting goes I’ve seen some really nice T5 setups, but I always had luck just a Current USA single satellite power compact light over my FW tank. You can add in the actinic if you like the look, but they also make bulbs specific to FW you might want to consider. Canister filters are your new best friends, find a cheap one and fix it up yourself to save some cash.

 

Temp ~75 should do you just fine. Cycle the tank, add things slowly, and enjoy!

[masterbuilder]

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/

[gator11]

I'm a little confused about how I should cycle the tank though... when I set up my SW I used live rock and live sand, although with a FW, those two things aren't an option. So what do I do to cycle it?

 

Oh, another thing that popped into my head. For SW I'm using live rock and Chaeto for biological filtration, and have hermits and snails as a CUC. How does that translate to FW? Is there some form of biological filtration I could use, and are there FW things that I could use as a CUC? Thanks for all the help so far!

[OkcKoolaid]

alritey, 1st off how did you decide on asking saltwater people about freshwater, there are freshwater sites you know, secondly here you go on some info

 

 

you can start the cycle by a) get some substrate, plants, or filter pad from a running tank be mean and put some mollies in there and then take them back to LFS after your done

 

if your going to go planted tank and you want it to look like a million dollars you will need Co2 and a good nutrious substrate as well as fertilizers, or you can do like i do and just heavily stock my planted tank and feed it a lot

 

you can use snails and cherry shrimp to help with algae but ultimately like saltwater you will have to scrape the glass

 

so if you get enough plants in there that should take care of your filtering needs, you just need to make sure there are no deadspots in your tank and you really only need like 10 times turnover in your tank

 

hope you read this and next time go on a freshwater site, its much much easier

[gator11]

thanks for all the help guys. and for all of you disgruntled that I asked for your help, because I value your opinions, I want to let you know that I have now gone over to plantedtank.net, and asked them as well. so have no fear, I won't bother you with FW questions again.

[fishboy87]

I belong there on the same name. Great site and you'll def. get your questions answered

[Mr. Fosi]

Just like a reef tank, before you set this tank up you should decide what you want to keep.

 

Not all plants require the same lighting or water conditions (soft vs. hard, high pH vs. low). They also don't all require the same type of fertilization strategy. They also aren't all the same cost and if you want to have a successful, algae-free tank you need to initially plant as densely as possible and leave out the fish until the plants become established.

 

Some plants will root deeply, others won't so you have to plan out how deep the substrate will be and what it will be composed of. Fluorite is a great suggestion and if you go with the red, it compliments the green of the plants very nicely.

 

Also think about whether you will want to worry about CO2 or liquid fertilizer addition.

 

Why don't you post a list of plants you want to keep? Then we can decide what sort of setup you need.

[skimlessinseattle]

Just like a reef tank, before you set this tank up you should decide what you want to keep.

 

Not all plants require the same lighting or water conditions (soft vs. hard, high pH vs. low). They also don't all require the same type of fertilization strategy. They also aren't all the same cost and if you want to have a successful, algae-free tank you need to initially plant as densely as possible and leave out the fish until the plants become established.

 

Some plants will root deeply, others won't so you have to plan out how deep the substrate will be and what it will be composed of. Fluorite is a great suggestion and if you go with the red, it compliments the green of the plants very nicely.

 

Also think about whether you will want to worry about CO2 or liquid fertilizer addition.

 

Why don't you post a list of plants you want to keep? Then we can decide what sort of setup you need.

+1

 

I have a 55 gallon planted tank that has taken me years to get right, and Mr. Fosi couldn't be more right. Plant heavy at first, or you will be fighting a long war!

 

I recommend the flourite substrate, it is very good stuff. Most plants require 2wpg to survive, and a little more to thrive. I have 4wpg on my tank with CO2 injection. But again, it all depends on what you want to keep. A basic generalization here is that plants with a red color require more light 3+ wpg.

 

Ditch the 50/50 powercompact, the actinic will create an infestation of algae. Yeah, it looks cool, but trust me, been down that road...

 

Unlike a reef tank where NO3 and PO4 are the devil, both are macronutrients in a planted tank. You must have sources of these if you want your plants to live. You get both of these from fish food and fish waste. Fertilization is usually not necessary if you keep some good waste producing fish. Potassium is also a very important macro that needs to be present in your water. Supplementation may be necessary here.

 

As far as clean up goes, cory cats and ottos are a planted tanks best friend. DO NOT get a pleco. They need really big tanks, I'm talking 75+ gallons. They get huge. Don't get one!

 

Water source is important too. To keep plants, water hardness is key as most don't do well at a hardness of over 150ppm. A good idea is to use a mix of RO and tap water to get your hardness right for the species of plants you plan to keep. A lot of nice fish that go great in planted tanks don't do well in hard water either; neon tetras for example. I mix 50/50 RO and tap. Just make sure your tap water is chlorine free.

 

As far as carbon goes, I don't use it currently. Have in the past, but don't find it necessary.

 

Water changes are crucial. Do them on a regular basis.

 

Hope this helps.

[Mr. Fosi]

As far as clean up goes, cory cats and ottos are a planted tanks best friend. DO NOT get a pleco.

 

Good advice here but you should also add in Amano Shrimp (Caridina japonica) and Siamese Algae Eaters (Crossocheilus siamensis). Beware of LFSs that say they sell SAE's because often they are actually Flying Foxes (Epalzeorhynchos kalopterus).

 

Ottos are algae destroyers but they are fragile and you need to have care when transporting them and make sure that your water pH and hardness isn't outside of their preferred range or you will lose no less than 50% of those you buy within the first week.

 

A good idea is to use a mix of RO and tap water to get your hardness right for the species of plants you plan to keep.

 

This is a segment of the hobby where tapwater is your friend and RO can be the enemy.

 

Adjusting hardness with RO is a good idea but do not use straight RO water in a planted tank. That creates havoc with the osmotic balance of your plants' cells and they will die. Short-term RO treatments (up to 2-weeks if your plants are hardy) for epiphytic (on the plant leaves) algae have worked well for me in the past but they aren't something you want to have to do.

 

Water changes are crucial. Do them on a regular basis.

 

Not if you choose hardy plants like Cryptocoryne species or java fern/moss. Anubias are hardy as well but they grow large and they don't renew their leaves often so you need to have the microalgae under control or they will look like crap.

 

I shoot for a balance in all my FW planted tanks so I can do monthly or bi-monthly waterchanges and simple topoffs in between.

[shahrezsyed]

the answer in the first reply is all you need.

just add pure ammonia to cycle and maintain it at 5ppm and when the ammonia finishes voila! your tank is cycled very easy.you can pm me and ask me abt anything abt fw tanks cuz i,ve been runnin from mollies to discus in fw but still researching for a sw tank dont know a thing about sw tanks.and you,ll get biological filtration from the filter media as in it will trap solid waste and be a home for your bacteria.

cheers,

shahrez

[lakshwadeep]

Here's a neat tank setup by a former SW owner:

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2008/5/aquarium

 

Also, you shouldn't feel embarassed to ask basic FW questions here. Many members started out in FW, so this wasn't a pointless question.

[gloryforixseal]

Stunning planted tank

 

Youve inspired me to spend the last hour tidying mine up, it had become a bit neglected and over-grown. Pictures later in the week once the water has cleared and Ive re-hoovered the substrate.. .

[AquariKeeper]

In my 20 long planted I have a two bulb grow light t-5 fixture. I used Rasbora hets as my cycling fish. Now, like a month later I have Rotala, hairgrass, glossiostigma, dwarf lilly and java fern growing extremely well...I don't use CO2 or any fertilizers really, I put about an inch or two of non-fertilized Mississippi topsoil in first and covered it with fine white gravel. No real need for fluorite if your topsoil is about neutral and nice and dark.

 

Just my personal experience, probably won't work with other topsoils but it works wonders for me!

[clockwork john]

I'll second the recommendations for Ottos, SAEs and Amano shrimp for a CUC. You may also check out cherry shrimp. Similar to Amanos, but a stunning red color.

 

Where are you located? I have about 30 pounds of a laterite/aquarium gravel mix I'm not using. I'm too lazy to ship, but I'd be happy to hook you up if you're semi-local to me. I could also give you a sponge from my filter to jump start your cycle.

[ghengis]

Being a planted tank keeper of wht I'd term medium experience, I thought I might wade into this one... All of the advice given has been spot on, particularly that of using ammonia to help cycle the tank. This is called fishless cycling and is far less cruel to poor little fishies.

 

Something that I picked up on, though, is the mention of using of an Aquaclear filter. If you intend to use a HOB, forget about runnig CO2. Whilst some will argue that it is possible, you will be pushing poo up a hill with trying to maintain any real level of CO2 in the water column. Too much surface agitation. Go for a canister instead... Unlike a SW environment, a certain amount of Nitrate in a planted tank can help tremendously, so a canister will not be a problem, just remember to service/clean it regularly.

 

Substrates can be an expensive minefield. Have never used any of the ADA or otherwise offerings. I have always found simple gravel of approx. 2mm grain size just perfect. This is of course purely personal choice and if you have the money, by all means go the high end gear. Just know that it is not absolutley necessary.