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MJ's 20L Formerly-AIO, now with a sump!


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#1
Militant Jurist

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Current Photo (I'll try to keep this as the most up-to-date): 6 December 2009
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First Official FTS:
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VITAL STATS:
Born on April 3, 2009 (DOB is the start of the cycle, the livestock transferred later from my old 10g).
Current Nova Extreme 96w T5HO (2x ATI Aquablue Special and 2x Blue Plus) with individual reflectors
Display waterflow rate: Approximately 720 GPH (an estimated 40x turnover rate) provided by MP10

Edited by Militant Jurist, 20 December 2009 - 08:09 PM.

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#2
dtfleming

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Are you having flow from both sides and two overflows?



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#3
Militant Jurist

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Now for the pictures!



Here's the tank from the side
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Here's the tank overhead::
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Here's the stand:
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Obviously, this is all still a work in progress. However, all of the silicon work is now done, it just needs to dry and have the AIO areas leak tested. While that is testing, I'll have the rest of the stand roughed in (which is how it will stay for a little while) but ready to use. I just have a lot more bracing and over-engineering to do!

Lighting: T5HO (currently 2x24, but maybe by spring that will be 4x24)
Left chamber: skimmer/filter and heater
Right chamber: fuge
Extra circulation: Koralia Nano

Oh, and to help stabilize the false walls, I've put pieces of plexi against the glass to help brace the wall.

Are you having flow from both sides and two overflows?


Indeed. Each side has its own overflow and powerhead acting as a return pump. The overflow on the right is in the front with the return on the back side.

Edited by Militant Jurist, 15 August 2009 - 08:36 PM.

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#4
vresor

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Very cool. I'm considering a similar approach with my 75 gallon cichlid tank. I'm looking forward to staying up with your progress!

#5
Militant Jurist

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It has actually been fun so far, and hasn't taken much time. Then again, I know a thing or two about drafting, and a big fan of measure twice, cut once. Now I'm just going to give everything the rest of the week to cure in the tank, and then I'll start bracing the stand. I'll have more pictures when there is water, although it will be fresh tap water just for the test. Still, it is wet water. Wetter than StevieT's water even. ;)

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#6
5galnanoreef

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very nice. I see no problems with your setup, as mentioned in the thread you have on the diy section. I think this is absolutely amazing and will work out well for you.

The stand, you can never over-engineer more than my dad or myself. he's an engineer and I'm studying to become one. HAHA. Nice stand though, it looks heavy but very functional. Good luck on the tank, and I'll be following along.

#7
Militant Jurist

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The one change I've made from the DIY thread is that I've gotten rid of the separator on the sump side. I've been running the skimmer/filter on my 10g and it doesn't have the output that it claims to have (in my opinion anyways) so I'm going to leave the sump flow unobstructed. I'm heading back from the holidays tomorrow, so the leak test on the chambers will then begin! Thanks for following along. B)

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#8
OB1

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I especially like the green and orange flower decoration on the bottom. :lol:
Looks like a good idea. Do you plan to black out the sump and fuge area?

#9
Militant Jurist

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I especially like the green and orange flower decoration on the bottom. :lol:


Lol, thanks! It's actually a part of the old metal table that has become a temporary workbench, at least until I can build a proper one!

Looks like a good idea. Do you plan to black out the sump and fuge area?


I'm going to be building a top for the tank that will make it an enclosed system. I've left room on the top of the stand to take care of the HOB equipment, and then I'm going to make a swinging door that will cover the excess space as well as the sump and fuge areas. That way, it hides the equipment, allows for some storage of supplies along side the tank and also hides the sump and fuge areas when I don't want to look at them. This way, I can enjoy looking into the fuge when I so desire instead of having to peer over the top of the tank.

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#10
vresor

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Hi Militant. I'm trying to picture your explanation above. So if you're looking at the tank from the front, you will be able to see in both side AIO overflow sumps (for lack of a better description)? The light from overhead will spill into them as well I'm guessing, right?

I'm intrigued because thanks to you, I'm working on my own version of this. It's a great idea. There are a couple potential snags in my tank though. First of all it's 24" deep. That will mean a long way for the light to penetrate and the water to fall into the overflow as evaporation lowers the water level in the AIO sumps. I think this could be controlled by having one pump with higher (or lower) capacity than the other. Suppose one sump were emptied (and therefore overflowed into) at 900 gph and the other at 1200 gph. I think the 900 gph sump level would drop with evaporation while the 1200 gph sump would remain at its equilibrium level. Does that make sense?

I may abandon the double AIO sump idea in favor of a single sump at one end and just let it remain visible from the display side. After all, the fuge and all the effort that goes into filtration and circulation is a part of this reef business; why hide it?

Thanks again for your thoughts and ideas.

#11
Militant Jurist

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Hi Militant. I'm trying to picture your explanation above. So if you're looking at the tank from the front, you will be able to see in both side AIO overflow sumps (for lack of a better description)? The light from overhead will spill into them as well I'm guessing, right?


Yeah, my plan is to leave both sides visible, but my "hood" (for lack of better description) will enclose the sides, with doors that can be opened or closed to reveal or hide the areas. I'm doing it this way because it is going into my home office, and if I need to ever bring my legal clients in, I want the tank and area to look as nice as possible!

I'm intrigued because thanks to you, I'm working on my own version of this. It's a great idea.


:D

There are a couple potential snags in my tank though. First of all it's 24" deep. That will mean a long way for the light to penetrate and the water to fall into the overflow as evaporation lowers the water level in the AIO sumps. I think this could be controlled by having one pump with higher (or lower) capacity than the other. Suppose one sump were emptied (and therefore overflowed into) at 900 gph and the other at 1200 gph. I think the 900 gph sump level would drop with evaporation while the 1200 gph sump would remain at its equilibrium level. Does that make sense?


The extra depth in your tank does add a bit of a twist to the design. To handle the light issues, you'll have to either add some extra lighting, or just aquascape so that you'll have a lot of higher level real estate for light light corals to grow, and use the lower areas for low light corals, such as mushrooms, etc.

As for the pumps, that setup might help a bit, but with an AIO, your evaporation will happen all over the tank, so both chambers and the display area will all be evaporating. If I recall correctly, you can minimize evaporation due to overflows by keeping the chamber's water levels fairly high relative to the tank. If the water has to fall a long way (I'd say 3 or more inches) you get a lot more evaporation, since you have a lot more water exposed to air, giving even more water vapor a chance to escape.

I may abandon the double AIO sump idea in favor of a single sump at one end and just let it remain visible from the display side. After all, the fuge and all the effort that goes into filtration and circulation is a part of this reef business; why hide it?


That's the exact same debate I had when beginning the design. I decided on the double sump because it was more of a symmetrical design, and I could hide powerheads on both sides of the tank for a more random water movement. In the end, that's what finally convinced me to go with chambers on both sides. I agree, the filtration and the fuge are all parts of the business, but sometimes it's nice to see just the finished product! I'm leaving mine unpainted, but leaving myself the ability to hide it when necessary.

Thanks again for your thoughts and ideas.


You're welcome! Feel free to ask any other questions you've got, and I'll do my best to help out. You'll have to let me know which way you end up going with your tank!

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#12
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I have also done an AIO 20L you can check my thread for ideas if u like....Feel free to ask as much as you want.... Mine is up and running over two months now LOVE IT!@

#13
CoRPS

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Any updates? I like the idea of having overflows on both sides of the tank. I did something kind of similar. Here's the link: http://www.nano-reef...howtopic=173463
Need custom acrylic work done for your tank? All In One systems, overflows, frag racks and lids! Going to be building custom acrylic tanks soon! PM me for details!

CoRPS' custom 20L AIO w/Rockwall
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#14
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Funny you ask, because as of today, there is!

I started getting sick on Friday, so this weekend has been a productive weekend in the basement. I finally got the stand together and the tank is full of tap water for a leak and weight test. I over engineered the stand, but I still don't trust it yet. I've tested the equipment and it's all working fine, the next test will be to add some food coloring to make sure I don't have any leaks with the false walls. I'm waiting on the camera to charge, and I'll post up some pictures of the wet trial run. I'm going to let it sit in the basement for a week or to confirm the structural integrity of the stand. It's just framed with 2x4s at this time, with the oak siding to come along later.

Here's the plan:

After the wet trial has concluded, the tank is getting filled with saltwater and approx. 15 lbs of dead rock. To help seed the rock, I'm going to be adding the weekly WC discard water into the tank as well as pulling a bit of the existing sand and adding either dry or live sand as a base. The 10 gallon tank will continue to run during this time, and I'm going to allow the 20L AIO to cycle for at least 30 days.

Sound like a good plan?

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#15
CoRPS

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Sounds good, just for safe measure I'd either buy a couple pounds of nicely cured LR or take a couple pounds out of your 10g.

Can't wait to see the pictures man, I'm using a iron stand for my tank! Got my python in the tank below it.
Need custom acrylic work done for your tank? All In One systems, overflows, frag racks and lids! Going to be building custom acrylic tanks soon! PM me for details!

CoRPS' custom 20L AIO w/Rockwall
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#16
Militant Jurist

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I was tempted to pick up the fully cured stuff from a GREAT LFS (seriously, they are one of the best stores I've been to, and they actually turn away people who are doing too much too fast). However, I was still nervous about picking up a nasty hitchhiker and having it wreck havoc on my work so far.

I did forget to mention that I've had several pieces of dry rock, a good 2 lbs worth, already placed in my 10 gallon for the last month or so, enough that it's already starting to color up. Those rocks will be going into the 20L for the cycle to help get things rocking.

Pictures of the stand and tank will be uploaded in the AM!

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#17
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Ok, so here's the update: (ignore the crap in the background)

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And finally, the money shot! ;) - It's even taken from behind! :P

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Confession: I did something incredibly stupid in the process of building the false walls. I was using masking tape to help keep the caulk lines fairly straight and clean. However, I forgot just how clean my new pieces of plexi were, and accidentally caulked and super glued into place a piece right over the masking tape! I went back over the seam after realizing this, and I'm hoping that I've completely sealed that in place. I'm keeping an eye on it while leak testing with tap water to make sure it doesn't start soaking. The tape is on the back facing side of the tank, and it will eventually be hidden by a wood door I'll be building to hide the chambers, but I had to confess my crime anyways.

Edited by Militant Jurist, 23 February 2009 - 08:06 PM.

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#18
bzphotog

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very nice. the stand looks really stable. good work

#19
adolfo425

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Looking good on the DIY.

Can't wait to see it stocked.

Adolfo is the name and reefing is the game.

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#20
Militant Jurist

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very nice. the stand looks really stable. good work


Thanks! I put to use my knowledge of 4 years of HS woodshop plus practical experience and engineered the crap out of it! So I'm hoping to not have problems. ;) I'm hoping to be able to get some oak or birch plywood on the sides to dress it up, and I'm going to get some MDF to solidify the top.

Looking good on the DIY.

Can't wait to see it stocked.


Thanks! The plan is to start the cycle on Monday of next week. The livestock that will be going in here in about a month is the coral currently in the 10 gallon in the sig. This tank will be an upgrade, and then some new corals will be added as well!

Edited by Militant Jurist, 24 February 2009 - 07:01 PM.

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#21
Militant Jurist

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The cycle might not start monday, since I'd decided to paint the 2x4s in order to thoroughly waterproof it. I picked up some plywood for the top tonight, and I'm going to pick up some foam so that the tank will be more stable should the wood warp even a bit.

Equipment list:
2 built in powerheads (between 80 and 120gph, I can't really remember)
1 K-nano
Heater
Taam Rio Skilter
48w T5HO (could soon be 96w)

I'm moving the 10 gallon in the sig into this tank, and hoping to keep some lower light SPS (monti, birdsnest, etc) in the near future.

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#22
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Update?
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#23
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I've got some of the dry rock purchased and made some minor modifications to the plexi on the false walls to keep the water levels where I want them, since they chambers were a bit unbalanced. I had to go out of town to visit a sick relative over the weekend, so I didn't get a chance to seal the stand, so no water yet! I'm hoping to be able to get that done tomorrow evening after work, so that the cycle can begin this week.

Thanks for checking!

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#24
Militant Jurist

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FINALLY!

The tank is running with salt water and dead rock. I'll be adding pictures tonight (I hope!).

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#25
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The tank is currently cycling and has already gone through the ammonia stage. I'm cycling the tank with a few pounds of LR and several pounds of dry rock. At the end of the month, the 10 gallon tank will be moving into this tank.

Final tank equipment list:
96w T5HO
2 traditional powerheads for the chambers
Koralia Nano
Taam Rio Nano Skimmer / Filter

Now for the pictures!

FTS (a bit from an angle, and not showing the side chambers):
Posted Image

The new (no ID) live rock:
Posted Image

Edited by Militant Jurist, 15 April 2009 - 05:18 PM.

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