Ph question?

[glennr1978]

The Ph in my tank fluctuates between 7.93 and 8.20 in a 24 hour period (per data log on ACJR). First of all, is this large a swing okay? Secondly, I've tried to raise the Ph with Seachem's "Reef Buffer" to no avail. I've followed the directions on the label, and it does temporarilly raise the Ph a little bit, but it raises dkh as well. My tank typically tests at 9.5 to 10.5 dkh and after adding "Reef Buffer" it tested at 12. That was getting a bit higher than I am comfortable with. So do you guys have any ideas what else I could do to try to raise the Ph and keep it stable in the more commonly accepted 8.1 to 8.3 range without raising dkh to potentially dangerous levels? Or should I be okay with the readins/ fluctuations I currently have?

 

The reason for this post is because I have been having issues with about 4 (out of approximately 20+) of my SPS fading quite a bit, but not bleaching. All other relevant parameters are in line with the exception of a somewhat low Mg reading of 1050ppm (currently working on getting it up to 1350, at 1200 now). I do skim pretty heavily on my tank. I have a low bioload and don't feed huge amounts. To counter for the heavier skimming I do wc's more frequently and have added a lugol's dosing as part of my weekly maintenance routine.

[d0ughb0y]

my ph used to vary from 7.8 (morning) to 8.2 (alk is around 8 to 9). One day, I pointed my koralia upwards to move the surface water some more, then without any other change, now I constantly get 8.2 ph anytime of day. you can try that to see if it works for you.

[glennr1978]

my ph used to vary from 7.8 (morning) to 8.2 (alk is around 8 to 9). One day, I pointed my koralia upwards to move the surface water some more, then without any other change, now I constantly get 8.2 ph anytime of day. you can try that to see if it works for you.

Thanks for the tip, I'll give that a shot. Although I'm not sure if it will work, I already have quite a bit of surface agitation going on as it is. Worth a shot none the less . I'm also going to open up the windows for a while in the room the tank is in. It's been raining here so it's actually cool enough outside to let the house air out a bit.

[lakshwadeep]

IIRC, when the lights go out, all the photosynthetic organisms (mainly algae) cannot consume any CO₂ and yet they are still respiring like all the other tank inhabitants (not the same as our breathing). This causes increased CO₂ concentrations and an acidification (lowering of pH) of the water. This is why 2 part solutions, which increase alkalinity, are recommended to be added after the lights turn off to help keep the pH from dipping while avoiding pH spikes that would happen in the day.

[glennr1978]

IIRC, when the lights go out, all the photosynthetic organisms (mainly algae) cannot consume any CO₂ and yet they are still respiring like all the other tank inhabitants (not the same as our breathing). This causes increased CO₂ concentrations and an acidification (lowering of pH) of the water. This is why 2 part solutions, which increase alkalinity, are recommended to be added after the lights turn off to help keep the pH from dipping while avoiding pH spikes that would happen in the day.

Very true...I guess I should've stated my 2 part dosing routine as well, and my lighting schedule. 2 x's 24w T-5's on at 12:30PM, 250w mh on at 1:30 PM, mh off at 9:30, T-5's off at 10:30. Fuge light on at 10:30pm, and off at 12:30pm.

 

I dose 40mL of B Ionic 2 part daily. I have a little DIY dosing pump system rigged up that works beautifully. I dose 20mL of part 1 (alk) at 11:30pm, and another 20mL at 5:30am (it may be 6:30am, I really don't remember). Not that it's relevant, but the Ca part is dosed all 40mL at once at 3:00pm.

 

I have a soccer ball sized chunk of chaeto in the fuge that should help promote photosynthesis. Which in turn help to stabilize Ph, right?

 

So is the fluctuation I'm getting okay? Or do you guys think this may be the cause of the SPS fading.

 

In case anybody is thinking it may be old bulbs, it's not. I replaced the bulbs about a month ago.

[bdare]

Hey Glenn,

 

That Ph is fine. Remember you shouldn't add buffer based on the Ph. Buffer is just an alk supplement. If you alk is in range then Ph is simply a function of CO2 / O2 in the water.

 

If the SPS are bleaching I would look into 2 things... nutrients and phosphates. Mine were pretty bleached because I was keeping my water too clean. I started feeding more oyster eggs / rotifiers and became more generous with the fish feeding and things are coloring up much better.

 

Are you running any GFO in your phosban reactor? Remember to just start with a little bit. That was another mistake I've made...

 

I've also been adding Amino acids and Potassium.

 

Ben

[SeeDemTails]

Surface flow made all the difference in my tank, and I thought I had a lot too! A MJ 1200 right at the surface did the trick.

 

I wouldnt worry about it too much, that isnt that bad of a swing.

 

The sps might be fading because of the new bulb, and I am sure you probably cleaned your UV glass when you changed the bulb too. Some of my sps took color on within a week of me adding my second light, others like my green monti cap and 50% of my zoas, are still recovering from the extra light. I have a year old bulb and crappy reflector over my zoas just to make it easier on them, I hope they dont freak out when I change the bulb in the next month or so!

[glennr1978]

Hey Glenn,

 

That Ph is fine. Remember you shouldn't add buffer based on the Ph. Buffer is just an alk supplement. If you alk is in range then Ph is simply a function of CO2 / O2 in the water.

 

If the SPS are bleaching I would look into 2 things... nutrients and phosphates. Mine were pretty bleached because I was keeping my water too clean. I started feeding more oyster eggs / rotifiers and became more generous with the fish feeding and things are coloring up much better.

 

Are you running any GFO in your phosban reactor? Remember to just start with a little bit. That was another mistake I've made...

 

I've also been adding Amino acids and Potassium.

 

Ben

 

What's up stranger!!

 

I hadn't tested for phosphates in a while so I did just now. I'm still getting a a 0 (undetectable) reading, so that's not the problem. GFO= phosban right? I'm running the suggested amount of phosban in the reactor (don't remember exactly how much that is. I think it's around 150g??)Now that I think of it, the issue really started shortly after I installed the new skimmer and it "broke in". I wasn't very impressed with it at first, but now that thing skims some serious funk out of my tank. Maybe I'm skimming to heavily? Rather than cut the skimming down, I would like to add more livestock. I really want to add a group of 5 green chromis, but I'm afraid my purpleback will pick them off one by one.

 

I also haven't been feeding my corals in about a month (maybe tow). So yesterday I went and bought some more oyster eggs and gave them their first meal last night.

 

I'm still dosing "Coral Accel" everyday (amino acids and potassium). So I should be good in that department as well.

 

One thing I did notice last night, which I should've noticed before is that one of my fans died. In turn I've been having daily temp swings of about 2.5 degrees. I'm pretty sure that may have something to do with the stressed corals in my tank. I installed a new fan and "fine tuned" them along with my heater on the ACJR. I just checked the data log and the temp only fluctuated from 77.5 to 77.6 all night last night. I'm going to "fine tune" them even more after lights out tonight. Whatever the temp rises to throughout the day today (shouldn't be much), is what I'm going to set the tank to stay at. Hopefully this will basically eliminate any temp fluctuation what so ever.

[glennr1978]

Surface flow made all the difference in my tank, and I thought I had a lot too! A MJ 1200 right at the surface did the trick.

 

I wouldnt worry about it too much, that isnt that bad of a swing.

 

The sps might be fading because of the new bulb, and I am sure you probably cleaned your UV glass when you changed the bulb too. Some of my sps took color on within a week of me adding my second light, others like my green monti cap and 50% of my zoas, are still recovering from the extra light. I have a year old bulb and crappy reflector over my zoas just to make it easier on them, I hope they dont freak out when I change the bulb in the next month or so!

 

 

I re-positioned my 6025's last night and blasted the surface with water flow. Unfortunately, it didn't do anything.

 

If the fading has anything to do with the new bulb I've already tackled that possibility as well. I've hooked my T-5's back up, and cut the mh from 10 hours a day down to 8 hours. I just did this a few days ago so hopefully I will start to see some improvement soon.

 

On another note, I'm going to dilute part 1 (B Ionic) in my dosing routine by 50% and double the dosages. So now my tank will be dosed 4 times a night instead of two. I know you guys say the ph fluctuation isn't bad, but hey, better stability is better stability right?

[Phixion]

Your swing isn't so bad Glenn. According to the cheap pH probe I have hooked to my ACjr, I'm getting a rather significant pH swing daily. 7.51 by night and up to 8.1 by day. it's even dipped to the 7.2 territory. Needless to say, I have a new better (American Marine) pH probe in transit to me. My SeaChem test kit is showing my pH around 80.5 when the probe says 7.8 I'd finid it hard to believe I have a thriving tank at pH 7.3 ....

[SeeDemTails]

On another note, I'm going to dilute part 1 (B Ionic) in my dosing routine by 50% and double the dosages. So now my tank will be dosed 4 times a night instead of two. I know you guys say the ph fluctuation isn't bad, but hey, better stability is better stability right?

 

No doubt, I am getting a doser asap now that I have my chiller. I would definately break the dose into 4 parts if you can, alk part can be ruff on sps when you add it too fast.

 

As a matter of fact, now that I too am doising 40ml a day, the bottle says never more than one ml per gal, but I think that is only when rasing your levels. I am going to start a Kalkwasser drip with an I.V. bag, which should really help keep my ca and lak stable, in addition to using b ionic.

 

I have found the more stable I keep the tank, even little things, the better everything is.

[glennr1978]

Your swing isn't so bad Glenn. According to the cheap pH probe I have hooked to my ACjr, I'm getting a rather significant pH swing daily. 7.51 by night and up to 8.1 by day. it's even dipped to the 7.2 territory. Needless to say, I have a new better (American Marine) pH probe in transit to me. My SeaChem test kit is showing my pH around 80.5 when the probe says 7.8 I'd finid it hard to believe I have a thriving tank at pH 7.3 ....

Did you calibrate it properly? I have a feeling you and I are using the same probe, and mine works great.

 

No doubt, I am getting a doser asap now that I have my chiller. I would definately break the dose into 4 parts if you can, alk part can be ruff on sps when you add it too fast.

 

As a matter of fact, now that I too am doising 40ml a day, the bottle says never more than one ml per gal, but I think that is only when rasing your levels. I am going to start a Kalkwasser drip with an I.V. bag, which should really help keep my ca and lak stable, in addition to using b ionic.

 

I have found the more stable I keep the tank, even little things, the better everything is.

 

 

Good luck with the kalk! i have never been able to figure that stuff out. I always do more harm than good with it.

[dtfleming]

I get a ph swing too, from 7.8 up to 8.2 during the day. Sometimes i can keep it at 8.0. I have alot of surface movement and a fuge. I also started to add kalk to my topoff water, this seems to help alittle with the ph. I also dose 2-part daily.

[SeeDemTails]

I got good with it because I had to maintain 125g SPS tanks with no ca reactors! You gotta watch your ph though, it will get up near 8.45 so you have to be careful.

[dtfleming]

yes it will jump up quick mad that mistake once. I should say that I add two teaspoons of kalk to 5gal of ro/di water. My topoff run's three times a day.

[bdare]

Hey Glenn,

 

Keep in mind as well with the Phosphate test kits they really aren't very accurate. You need a photometer to really pinpoint where your phosphates are.

 

I have a feeling since you prolly haven't changed your feeding habits it has to be from either the new light as others have suggested or the skimmer. Maybe the corals are just HUNGRY!

 

BTW...I'm really not a strager. I'm here everyday, but I usually just check the Chem forum and skim over the others...

 

Ben

[eklikewhoa]

I don't think your SPS fading problem is with the pH swings.....Mine will swing from 8.1 down to about 7.8 during the nights and my SPS are super colorful.

 

I am overskimming on my 30g as well as having 2xK2 pointed to the surface as well as the overflow breaking water surface and none of it helped with the pH fluctuation. At one point there was a reverse photo-period on my fuge with tons of different macro but that did not help either which is why I am at the large skimmer now which is an Octopus NW-150 and the skimmer didn't help none either. In my tank the top off water has kalk in it which does help to some extent but the fluctuation is still there.

 

I have given up on it since all parameters are within spec. and everyone is happy.