Hello my fellow reefers,

I would like to announce that my lfs guy actually turned me down for a sale. Yes, thats right, i explained to him that i had ~10.5lbs of figi rock in a 4mo established 10 gallon tank, and wanted more to fill the tank view up, he explains that it was a bad idea to be adding live rock after a tank had been set up with fish and corals already in place for an extended period of time. He DENIED me a sale because he "had no intrest in killing off perfectly good marine life." I was amazed to say the least, but he might of had some actual good ideas. My question is....Was he correct about not adding the rock late??? By the way the rock is cured figi... top of the line stuff. Thanks for reading, and please give me your thoughts.

lol

I'd say he was being a bit over-cautious. The problem w/ adding more live rock to an established system is that no matter how cured the rock is, there is going to be some amount of die off, which could spike the tank (increase ammonia levels) and kill livestock. Given that, you should add small pieces slowly, leaving a good 2 weeks or so in between each addition. It would have been fine for him to let you take home a small piece and to have explained that to you.

By the way I was a horrible salesperson when I worked at a fish store for years. I told people no left and right, haha. Good to hear I'm not the only reef nazi.

this is a good hobbiest(sp?), bad employee. they are correct, but their boss wouldn't be happy because they lost a sale because the employee cares. well done LFS guy, I salute(sp?) you. [sorry about sp, its late]

you can add rock, dead or alive, just not too much at once.

Yeah this guy is the owner of the store so he knows his stuff, plus its an all saltwater shop. I just thot is was hilarious because most of the time i try to test salesmen with my little bit of knowledge, and they always try to make a sale no matter what (AT DIFFERENT SHOPS THAN THIS ONE)....e.g. "Can i put that full grown lion fish in my 10 gallon nano" Answer= "sure, no problem" swear to it!!!

This, however, wasn't a test and i he did not explain to me that adding little pieces at a time would work so i thank you all for sharing that with me. Thats what im gonna start doing.

Hey, feel free to share some "LFS guy" experiences with me.... i know yall got some. THANKS

I worked at an LFS for about 5 years and I always thought it was fun to go into other stores and play stupid with them. I haven't worked at an LFS for about 2 years now and still like to go do it

It was always difficult for me not to intervene when I heard them giving out bad advice, although I did at least on one occasion I can remember. Moron at walmart was trying to sell this lady a 10g tank for a medium sized red ear slider.

HAHA......yea it's sad that people would put these amazing creatures in harms way, while ripping people off just to make a buck. But what can i say........i voted for McCain lol

Do you even have any livestock? Bc if its only LR right now, what would you even be killing off? You'd really be doing the tank a FAVOR by feeding the hungry bacteria!

the best thing is to get a bucket/container and cycle it for a week or so and then quickly put it in your main tank.

sorry, i disagree. if your tank already is established with some rock and has some nutrient processing capacity, AND his rock is cured and of decent quality, there is no reason for any die-off. even if in some random fashion there was, both sets of LR should handle any of the extra nutrients and no spikes should be seen.

on the other hand, you could potentially inoculate the tank with different strains of microbes, and there might be a re-balancing of populations which could manifest as bacterial or diatom blooms. to limit this i tend to acclimate anything new that goes into my tank until it is in 100% water from the final tank in which it is to sit, and swish it around to get any loose bio-detritus off.

Well, you only asked him if you "could" put a full grown lion in a 10G. You should have asked if it would survive longer than a week.

I just bought some extra live rock, mostly small pieces to turn into new zoo colonies, etc. I set up another tank that I usually use for a QT tank, but, since I don't plan on buying any fish for a while, I put the new LR in it. (Running it in an empty tank with a ball of chaeto.) I think this should allow any ammonia from die off to be absorbed and give me a chance to catch any bad hitchhikers in the act before they end up in my display. (so far so good, only a couple aiptasia and some GHA.)

I've added new live rock to my 50g, 15g frag system, and 12g AP with no problems ever. The 50g was built as an emergency upgrade when my nano broke so it had about 25lbs of rock and I added about 10lbs on 4 separate occasions. I also did this with fish, inverts, soft, and LPS corals in it with no mini-cycle or die off. My LFS is a 15 minute drive and they cure rock for 6 weeks in their basement before they put it up for sale in the shop.

If your system is established and stable and the rock you introduce is cured, I don't see a problem. Just make sure the new rock volume isn't more than your stable rock.

well given the average noob may think they know the difference between cured and uncured rock and the average fish store idiot doesn't know the difference i'd say it is much safer to have people go slower w/ fewer pieces at a time so they don't f**k up their tank.

smell the live rock, newly added live rock (uncured) usually has an ammonia stench to it while cured live rock smells like flowers? o.O

+1 to the LFS owner being over-cautious. If you could have got the rock in a separate tank/container and tested the water it's in for a few days, you should be able to determine whether it's okay to add to the tank. It's also best to keep the rock underwater while transporting it.

lol, if that guy is the owner, the LFS won't last long, imo. bad business.

Imagine what would happen if there was a bit of die off and an ammonia spike. The whole tank would die because he sold him the live rock. Now THAT would be bad business.

you're giving out fish - i'm teaching how to fish.

If you buy the rock cure it yourself. Even the process of bringing it home can lead to die off and may cause an ammonia spike in your tank. I always cure LR before adding it to a working display. Just do a water change save the change water put the LR in and throw in a powerhead and a heater and wait a week or two. Sure some of the pretty coralline may die off from lack of light but the rock will be cured and resettled by the bacteria existing in your current tank. I say the LFS owner made the right call although he could have explained your options to you better. A good LFS knows that by keeping people's tanks alive they will keep coming back for more business, if he gave you the wrong advice and your tank died you would never come back. The fact that he didn't just try to make the "sale" means he's probably doing pretty well for himself right now.

oh yea I totally agree that he made the right decision and gave me good advice, but I just found it funny because I think MOST LFS would have made that sale regardless of the outcome. I wasn't positive his advice was correct either, but from all of your great posts I can rest assure the LFS does know the business. THANKS

Haha, I turned down so many sales when I was a LFS employee- glad to see I'm not the only one. It's amazing how ignorant some people could be. This one guy talked about all of the angels and tangs that he had successfully kept in is 46g when he was trying to buy a hippo tang. Later he admitted that they had all died, which was why he was buying more... EDIT: Needless to say, I said no.

when LFS show they care about not just the sale or even their store, its seemed like he was trying to keep your tank alive and also the livestock in it. and there is die off on all rocks, even if its been sitting there for 2 months and then you switch it over to yours, it happened to me and i had a 20G and this guys is only a 10G and i added one piece of rock. and got a huge spike. i live 10 minutes away from the store

What about adding live sand to an established tank? Is it the same argument as rock, or is it ok?

Bagged "live" sand is not very live, so it won't have a big impact. I think if you have enough live rock, adding sand won't be harmful. However, replacing an old sand bed may cause a mini-cycle.

I was planning on adding 7+ pounds of non bagged sand from my LFS thats 20 blocks away. Safe?