thanks man I must say many people do not agree with all that I say but thats the fun of forums you just type up a bunch of crap and see if it sticks.

well your rants definately stick. it has me looking at my pico in a whole new light. i am going to try something new and see if my algea problem gets better.

so is that what they are Brandon?

and what will you try, badfish? I could use advice lol.

newman they are definately not due to a few reasons.

I can't identify them, that would be Dr. Ron Shimek in one of the many online forums he frequents, the fact that man posts free information to the web when he could be charging for it in books is always nice. for invert id, if he can't call it I don't bother looking.

these have calcareous tubes that support the bottom third of the animal. they are some kind of featherduster or colonial anemone-like feather duster, I have no idea what they are. the speed at which they retract into the tubes when scared is so fast it cannot be anything but a worm of some type.

if I start that thread I'll link it here.

What I like about them best is they model the seafloor vents with those 10,000 year old stands of red tubeworms but in micro form. I didn't put them there is what strikes me most.

Fab has those in his tank plus healthy plant growth which Im missing in a plant-sterile approach, if there was a way to plumb a refugium to the bowl id do it lol

100 percent water changes just after a heavy feeding.

yep thats one way that works, and in addition to times I walk by the tank and just change it all anyway because its a safety net, what does it hurt to be dissolved nutrient free lol just a different way.

Watching ElFab attain the densest live rock growth with the full mix of animals on consistent partial changes has been fascinating and very important to what I mentally note about pico reefs.

His refugium extends the time we'd normally be doing a feed/change, but for pico reefs that don't have a fuge, or a very helpful one, full water changes are just snap and take the place of like 5 core activities people must attain for any marine tank

oooo a big water change eh? that would be a huge problem for my tank as one of my favorite corals is very high up in the tank and will be completely exposed for far too long.

@brandon: wooo, theyre not hydroids! I thought i had a hydroid plague when i saw them on my rocks lol. I seem to have two colors of them now. the originals I had are tan/yellow/brown like yours with brown tubes and tannish funnel+tentacles, but now I notices a new color, a brown tube but bright green funnel and tentacles. these things glow neon green under blue LEDs, theyre easily my favorite HH now.
You know I'm willing to bet they are worms for reasons you described. fast retraction, the calcerous tubes. they probably are

the hydrocoral part of the medusa stage in hydroids is likely not ever seen in our tanks, probably the size of a human hair diameter. its the later stages that look like twisting pink growths with spiky ends, and white contorted microgrowths with spiky little ends, those are the larger bodies we can usually spot on live rock.



what kind of coral is it, all of them I know don't mind emersion

also consider just doing the changes more often, rather than 100%. same thing, and your corals don't have to come out of the water. there are complex charts online about how many partial water changes it takes to totally export a tank, its A LOT of work so usually smaller pico reefs that don't have refugiums or a skimmer need to find a way to accomplish it...


part of changing the way we approach water changes is to keep the work as low as possible so we won't procrastinate, whether its regular partial or full changes.

for mine, I just keep a three gallon standard water container under my sink, set at 1.023 with nothing but the top open so it won't go bad. not circulated, not heated.

I siphon the water out into the sink, so there are no water buckets, and then reach down and pour the cold water under the sink cabinet into the tank letting the heater in the pico catch it up from like 74 to 79 ish lol what I do to my corals is lunacy, pick and choose your tactics lol but I don't baby them.

the point is by having it ready made, and three full water changes with just a three gallon jug, means its so fast you won't put it off like a larger reef and all that rigamarole

its a green finger leather...

I used to do 40% water changes weekly but reduced due to seeing my leather not opening for days after being subjected to air.

makes sense. but i don't think my tank could survive a temp swing like that. wow! but to each there own. obviously it doesn't hurt yours.

yes its wiser to take a sec, draw a quick hot sink bath and set the change water in it. likely 3 mins is 78 degrees from an average of 73 ish on the water. this is what I have to do in winter when sink area gets like 68.

good call on the leather, not a species I work with much if you have found emersion sressful maybe you could lower it slightly to allow for more export per water change regimen and I forgot to ask do you use a fuge like El Fab has shown in his thread?

lol yes, My tank is designed after El Fab's and yes I use that fuge.
The problem with the leather is that its grown onto the top most rock, and its the biggest rock in the tank so I cannot move it down lol.
But I think I figured my problem with algae! I need to use true RO/DI water instead of Walgreens/Poland Spring Distilled water haha. now to find a good cheap RO/DI unit.

well great Im happy you plated that soft coral on there and not just placed it, well done.

consider this idea for a weekends work it could do a lot for your tank.

Imagine taking an airline hose, running it out the top of a 3 or so gallon water vessel on a shelf or something above your pico, you begin the airline siphon (slow due to diameter) into your tank, it begins to fill up.

at the same time, you take another airline hose and siphon your tank water out into another container or a sink or something.

a flow through change, just watch your hoses so a snail won't crawl on them or something gets stuck on one. by the time you run a whole change container through it occasionally, no water drained on your nice leather and thorough changes just to rock n roll from time to time.
the fuge does alot for the tank, this is just a way to change more water with very very little work.

lol roll your change water into the reef room on an IV roller from above and hook it up like IV lines into a patient lol the medical approach

an awesome I dea but I got tons of tiny cerith snails running about (I must have 30+ in that tank) so the idea might be risky...plus no shelf above the tank lol and It would cause tons of issues to move the tank to a different location. Brandon can you please giv me RO/DI unit recommendations for me in the Equipment section of this forum? thanks I appreciate your help!



believe it or not, thats what I would do if I had one of those xD

RO/DI for $60. with dual tds meters and fresh DI media. can't beat that. wish i could pick it up.

http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=239644

great deal lol. thought only if I lived in Florida xD

newman sorry I have no experience with RO/DI all I have ever used is simple distilled water because I only need a gallon or three at a time lol really that's why.



but on your pass through water change idea it doesn't have to be an open line that could get plugged by a cerith, you could direct the outflow from the reef through any number of little plastic boxes that are cut with slits so 20 ceriths could crawl on them and flow would still get through the passes. like an old penn plax corner filter, anything to shroud the opening of your tube. do whatever it takes to change the water if algae are the prob lol, if its balanced like Fab's don't mess with it lol

I think the new RO/DI pure water should help a bunch. if not then I'll be forced to do another magnesium nuking of my tank to get rid of this Bryopsis >_<

but first up is trying to out-compete it with Chaeto in my fuge. I would do the constant water change thing but I'm afraid 1 the container on the shelf will get stagnant eventually since its constantly holding saltwater non stop, and 2. I dont have any shelves near the tank lol. 3. tank cant be moved. I'm in a bind I know, But I shall figure this out, thank you for all your help!

thanks for the brainstorming man El Fab has shown with a great fuge you don't need the hard change work and thats why he gets big applause from me.
B

El Fab rocks, this is by far my favorite look of his tank:
http://i140.photobucket.com/albums/r7/elfa.../Pico011410.jpg
cramped yes but if you think about it, it looks just like someone cut a piece of reef out and framed it in the 3 gal pico xD

Before tonight, the last time I tested my tank for nitrates was over a year ago (5/3/09). Tonight the test result showed zero and that's at the end of a full week.


I actually miss that look. My tank looks bare these days and it just isn't the same.

should never have touched it Fab.

lmao Badfish if he didnt touch it the monti would have grown so much ,I'm sure it would have made his tank explode with pressure xD (fragging it off might have been a solution lol.)

thanks for all the updates guys

EF with your nitrates that low I can see how partial changes are sufficient, Ive really enjoyed reading all this.
B

great, comprehensive guide! i would love to set up a pico tank right beside my 20g freshwater tank, i just need more money. i just started working 40 hours per week, so i should be able to afford it soon. get the cycling page up! hopefully that will be up when and if i set up a pico.

I glanced back through this thread and didn't see any suggestions... from searching online, it would appear that now all 3 lights (18W Coralife Mini Aqualight, 18W Current Satellite, and 36W Current Dual Satellite) have been discontinued?

Does anyone have any other good recommendations for 12" power compact solution? (I had hoped to get the 36W Currant Dual) I can't seem to find one (or perhaps my Google-fu is weak.)

cycling????

Keep searching the classifieds on here. Thats where I found my 36w dual satellite.

Thanks for the guide, very helpful.

Thnx for the guide! BUT, were is the cykling part?

It is very simple to find information on this, because for the most part, it is the same as a nano tank.

El Fab, you should do a section on good coral selection and tips on SPS picos

AGREED!!!!

Ok I have a 15 gallon 24x12x12 and want to know what ideal lighting for SPS and flow should be? I have a korilia nano 425 and a AC 70 filter already and two 18" t8's

Get a par38, and as much flow as you can.

im not sure if one PAR 38 is enough to cover to your tank. maybe two, or even three.

That's more money then I'm willing to spend right now. I was hping to go no more then $150 with taxes and shipping :-P I now plan on doing a AIO wih the same tank now putting a piece of plexi at the end 4 inches from one side and doing a few chambers. Now if the tank is shortened I can do a led diy with a shorter/ cheaper heatsink. Question now is what size should I get with a 20"x12"x12" tank? I want nice light coverage without the narrow spotlight look. I was thinking 12 leds but what would give me a good spread??!?!??! Aso what return should I use? I already have a RIO 2100 with 694 gph flow, it's a bit noisy, I can hear it outside of the tank which I don't like (they always say don't tap on the glass but they don't say DON'T HAVE LOUD PUMPS!). Thanks for any help.

No hits?!

If you're rocking two 18" T8s, even with an upgrade to the lighting, you should think of trying other corals before going for SPS. Most people who have good success with SPS either plan the tank to support them from the beginning or have cut their teeth with other corals. That being said, I would get a pair of Koralia 750s or an MP10 and 4 T5s (check out a sunlight supply tek II).


Also, this is for pico tanks...

sorry didn't mean to hijack.

still working on the cycling article?

excellent excellent thread! took and hour and 15 minutes to read but very informational. thanks alot el fab and brandon i have learned much from reading your posts the last 3 weeks...

Thanks so much for this super thread!

I'm new to the hobby and to this forum, but am learning through reading first, and have some equipment on the way to start my first saltwater tank (6 gallons...yes, I know this is too large to be a pico, but I'm loving the thread anyway).

Jamie

i've got a jbj pico with 3 lbs of live rock, live sand bed, maroon clown, peppermint shrimp, and a few crabs and snails.

not a single coral i put in there will open, and two of them have died. theyre not hard to grow corals anyway, just a zoa, frogspawn, and a green star pollup, it killed the zoa and the frogspawn, i just don't get it.

the filter and light is stock, 9w 50/50 pc flouresent, and i added a heater and powerhead(very weak)

nitrite
ammonia
nitrate
ph
phosphorus
all of the above tested 0
temp is a constant 78
if anyone's got some answers i'd love to hear it

make a thread for your tank and we will help you. the 1st thing that sticks out is that you shouldnt have a maroon clownfish in a 3gallon tank...

+100

do you think thats the reason the coral won't open

Do you feed a lot? That could be a reason.

The reason they won't open is because the light isn't very strong. Try mushrooms. The maroon is bad because it is wayyyyyyyyyyyy tttttttoooooooooooooooooo biiiiiiiiiiiigggggggggggg for your tank. You are limeted to small gobies and possibly small damsels. Your crabs can also be bothering your coral. What filter are you using?

I'm using the stock filter....the maroon clown is only a baby, the size of mt thumb. when the time comes i have a 30gallon he can go in but right now he's happy as can be....i have a peppermint shrimp could that be a problem


i feed the clown 5 spectrum pellets a day and occasionally cyclops

something to watch out for would be early algae battles with this tank, have pics?