Jump to content
Premium Aquatics Aquarium Supplies

Mr. Aqua cube Sump Fuge. Advice please!


Mr. Microscope

Recommended Posts

Mr. Microscope

Hello All,

 

I\'m about to build my sump fuge thing. \'Planning to use acrylic for the dividers/baffles etc. I bought a Mr. Aqua 12 inch cube to go under my Mr. Aqua 25 gallon DT. Yes, I understand this is a bit small, but no other standard tank sizes will fit in the stand. I have no experience with sump design. I think I\'ve about got it here, but maybe I\'m way off. I calculated the total volume while running to be about 3.5 gallons or less. That gives me about 4 spare gallons in case my overflow leaks and I lose 3 inches of water in the DT.

 

Thanks in advance for any advice, critique, or comments!

 

Here it is. Tear it up!

Sump02SideB01.jpg

 

Sump02SideC01.jpg

 

Sump02SideA01.jpg

Link to comment

Looks alright to me.

 

The one concern I might have is water taking the path of least resistance through the fuge and just flowing along the surface and into the skimmer chamber. Do you have plans to address this with a pump or anything?

 

Because the fuge is so small, and depending on your return pump's flow rate, it may not be an issue...

 

One other remedy might be to put a small baffle at the water surface through the middle of the fuge chamber just to force the water down.

 

Edit-

 

I personally would build it as is, and just leave the option open (have the materials cut and ready) to add the extra baffle after your first wet test.

 

Put your return pump in the return chamber with a hose to the drain chamber, and squirt something into the water to see what the flow looks like.

Link to comment

+1 to KG. The design looks good, but you may want to consider some way to "mix up" the water in the fuge section a little. Also, you could probably save some space by reducing the # of baffles. You could instead make it like this:

 

I I

I I I

I I I I I

I I I I I

I I I I I

I I I I I

I____I_____I_________________I

 

Note that I've seen both ways, I'm just thinking you could save a little space. That and you want a little bit of water volume in the "drain" chamber

 

Finally, recall that the "return" chamber will take the hit on all the evaporation action, so you should have a good ATO in action.

Link to comment
Mr. Microscope
Looks alright to me.

 

The one concern I might have is water taking the path of least resistance through the fuge and just flowing along the surface and into the skimmer chamber. Do you have plans to address this with a pump or anything?

 

Because the fuge is so small, and depending on your return pump's flow rate, it may not be an issue...

 

One other remedy might be to put a small baffle at the water surface through the middle of the fuge chamber just to force the water down.

 

Edit-

 

I personally would build it as is, and just leave the option open (have the materials cut and ready) to add the extra baffle after your first wet test.

 

Put your return pump in the return chamber with a hose to the drain chamber, and squirt something into the water to see what the flow looks like.

The return will be pretty light. Like 250GPH. I'm going to put an MP10 in the DT. So, I'm not too concerned about flow. Do you still think I could run into problems having a slow return?

I like your baffle in the fuge idea. Perhaps I'll add that too.

 

 

Thanks for the reply BTW. Really sincerely appreciated!

Link to comment
Mr. Microscope
Are you skimming in the return pump chamber?

Not to start, but that was the plan. Is that a problem? Hmm..thinking about it now does a skimmer require a constant water height?

 

+1 to KG. The design looks good, but you may want to consider some way to "mix up" the water in the fuge section a little. Also, you could probably save some space by reducing the # of baffles. You could instead make it like this:

 

I I

I I I

I I I I I

I I I I I

I I I I I

I I I I I

I____I_____I_________________I

 

Note that I've seen both ways, I'm just thinking you could save a little space. That and you want a little bit of water volume in the "drain" chamber

 

Finally, recall that the "return" chamber will take the hit on all the evaporation action, so you should have a good ATO in action.

Well, the spacing in the baffles was meant to have room for filter floss and carbon. They are about 1.5 inches each. You think they could be closer together?

 

Also, for a fuge, I thought the idea was to decrease flow.

 

Good point about the ATO. I hadn't considered that. Perhaps I'll raise the fuge depth an inch. Thanks!

Link to comment
Not to start, but that was the plan. Is that a problem? Hmm..thinking about it now does a skimmer require a constant water height?

 

To maximize efficiency and overall performance, yes.

They're typically located on the drain side to skim prior to H20 going to the fuge, etc.

You might have some microbubble issues with the skimmer in the return chamber.

Link to comment
The return will be pretty light. Like 250GPH. I'm going to put an MP10 in the DT. So, I'm not too concerned about flow. Do you still think I could run into problems having a slow return?

 

Thanks for the reply BTW. Really sincerely appreciated!

 

 

To be honest, I have a hard time imagining what 250 GPH looks like going through a sketchup model... haha. But I think it sounds good (which isn't saying much). Are you considering head pressure when estimating the return pump flow? I made the mistake of following one "expert" opinion with my return pump and ended up having a horrible sand storm in my tank until I put a valve in the line to slow things down... So I won't go as far as recommending GPH. Small pumps are cheap, so this shouldn't be too big of an issue for you if you need to try a few out to get it right.

 

Relatively slow flow is good for nutrient absorption in macro chaeto, and I think "deadspots" with close to zero flow are great for pod production... You just don't want the whole fuge to be dead still. Consider this:

 

a) No coral frag you may want to stick in there will be happy with zero flow

 

B) If new, fresh drain water doesn't get to the macro, the algae won't work efficiently.

 

Other than caulerpa and chaeto, I haven't had luck growing ANY macro that ReefCleaners offers (yes, tried every single one) in slow flow.

 

 

The friction of the water flowing along the surface may be enough to get a churning action in the fuge, which is what you want... I suppose you won't know until your first wet test.

Link to comment
Mr. Microscope
To maximize efficiency and overall performance, yes.

They're typically located on the drain side to skim prior to H20 going to the fuge, etc.

You might have some microbubble issues with the skimmer in the return chamber.

Okay. I haven't used a skimmer yet. So I wasn't sure about that. Thanks!

Link to comment

Have you considered Tee-ing off your return line to feed the fuge and cutting it out of the normal flow path? You can put a valve off the Tee and control the flow amount into your fuge.

This way you can run xGPH through your sump and dial back your fuge flow.

Link to comment
To maximize efficiency and overall performance, yes.

They're typically located on the drain side to skim prior to H20 going to the fuge, etc.

You might have some microbubble issues with the skimmer in the return chamber.

 

 

Oops... Didn't think of micro-bubbles... Hmm...

 

Check out aj and my fuge build threads. We worked around that issue in less than conventional ways.

 

I personally think that a fuge and skimmer shouldn't be in line, but parallel. Fuge before skimmer means the skimmer sucks up pods. Skimmer before fuge means the skimmer sucks up nutrients and micro algae for pods and macro.

Link to comment
Mr. Microscope
To be honest, I have a hard time imagining what 250 GPH looks like going through a sketchup model... haha. But I think it sounds good (which isn't saying much). Are you considering head pressure when estimating the return pump flow? I made the mistake of following one "expert" opinion with my return pump and ended up having a horrible sand storm in my tank until I put a valve in the line to slow things down... So I won't go as far as recommending GPH. Small pumps are cheap, so this shouldn't be too big of an issue for you if you need to try a few out to get it right.

 

Relatively slow flow is good for nutrient absorption in macro chaeto, and I think "deadspots" with close to zero flow are great for pod production... You just don't want the whole fuge to be dead still. Consider this:

 

a) No coral frag you may want to stick in there will be happy with zero flow

 

B) If new, fresh drain water doesn't get to the macro, the algae won't work efficiently.

 

Other than caulerpa and chaeto, I haven't had luck growing ANY macro that ReefCleaners offers (yes, tried every single one) in slow flow.

 

 

The friction of the water flowing along the surface may be enough to get a churning action in the fuge, which is what you want... I suppose you won't know until your first wet test.

Hmm. Food for thought..

The pump will fit in there with lots of room to spare, but good consideration on flow. I'm planning to make a Herbie with 3/4 inch PVC instead of 1 inch. I think it should be about right.

 

Was planning to use just chaetomorpha for the most part in the fuge. But good to know others really need flow.

 

Have you considered Tee-ing off your return line to feed the fuge and cutting it out of the normal flow path? You can put a valve off the Tee and control the flow amount into your fuge.

OOOOH! Mr. Microscope likey! Thanks for the idea. I could then run a deeper return an run less of a risk of a dry pump with evap.

 

Fuge before skimmer means the skimmer sucks up pods. Skimmer before fuge means the skimmer sucks up nutrients and micro algae for pods and macro.

Nice! There's a quote I can take to the bank. Gonna take that into consideration as well. It sucks working with such a tiny sump. Perhaps, I can rig it higher with some more acrylic to get a few more inches out of it.

Link to comment
OOOOH! Mr. Microscope likey! Thanks for the idea. I could then run a deeper return an run less of a risk of a dry pump with evap.

 

Yup.

I used this layout on my last build.

 

Drained to left side of sump w/ skimmer.

Overflowed through baffles into middle return.

Return line Tee'd into my fuge on the right side.

Dialed back flow with a ball valve.

Fuge had the highest baffle so in a power outage my DT wouldn't drain anything into my fuge.

Link to comment
Mr. Microscope
Yup.

I used this layout on my last build.

 

Drained to left side of sump w/ skimmer.

Overflowed through baffles into middle return.

Return line Tee'd into my fuge on the right side.

Dialed back flow with a ball valve.

Fuge had the highest baffle so in a power outage my DT wouldn't drain anything into my fuge.

..and fuge poured back into the return? Sounds good. Yeah, I see how the ball valve would be necessary.

Link to comment

Looks small, but good! nice sketch up skills.

 

The only issue I see still is the need for a very accurate ATO system. Because again any evap is going to affect the return chamber and at some point if it gets low enough it'll keep pumping water into the fuge, and not into the display (if there's not enough water pressure).

 

The only way I can see to keep that from happening is lowering/getting rid of the baffle between the return chamber and the fuge. In my case I didn't want to do that, so I just drilled a hole through that wall and inserted a strainer (at a point not too far above the sand bed). That way the water level in the fuge and in the return chamber are "linked" and so your exposure to evaporation is reduced should something go wrong while you're off for a weekend or something.

Link to comment
Mr. Microscope
Looks small, but good! nice sketch up skills.

 

The only issue I see still is the need for a very accurate ATO system. Because again any evap is going to affect the return chamber and at some point if it gets low enough it'll keep pumping water into the fuge, and not into the display (if there's not enough water pressure).

 

The only way I can see to keep that from happening is lowering/getting rid of the baffle between the return chamber and the fuge. In my case I didn't want to do that, so I just drilled a hole through that wall and inserted a strainer (at a point not too far above the sand bed). That way the water level in the fuge and in the return chamber are "linked" and so your exposure to evaporation is reduced should something go wrong while you're off for a weekend or something.

Great idea! I think that sounds like a very necessary modification for a sump this size. That'll about quadruple the water available to the return. It will also give be a better idea about evap since the fuge will be more accessible in the stand.

Link to comment
Mr. Microscope
Here's my old sump for reference:

 

I also used a Kent float valve in my return chamber for a gravity-fed ATO.

 

Looking better Mr. M.

Thanks for the image!

 

I decided to raise each of the baffles a half inch to add a little more height in case I add a skimmer. The skimmer section will now hold about 7.5 inches of water.

 

Thanks again for your help. I just got all my acrylic cut at the local Ace Hardware. There was an awesome guy cutting it for me. He used a lot of care and gave me a great deal since he used up some scraps they had laying around. I even got some extra pieces cut for the overflow in my DT. I also found the sealant there too. I'll post pics when it's complete.

Link to comment

Coolness. Your ACE hardware carries acrylic? Is it any good? I can't find anything more than 1/8" thick stuff anywhere but a plastics supplier. I never thought of checking ACE.

Link to comment
Mr. Microscope
Coolness. Your ACE hardware carries acrylic? Is it any good? I can't find anything more than 1/8" thick stuff anywhere but a plastics supplier. I never thought of checking ACE.

 

Naw, they only have the 1/8 inch stuff, but I gave them a list of sizes and they cut it for me. I think it'll work though.

Link to comment

Be sure to take and post pictures during the build. I'm sure there are a lot of people who would love to use it as an instuctional.

 

And I would recommend the Tunze Osomolator for an ATO. It's one of the more expensive, but it keeps your level rock solid.

Link to comment

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Recommended Discussions

×
×
  • Create New...